TECH INFO & GREAT LINKS TO TECH INFO!

[CowTipper]

You can't go by the number of freeze plugs, and there may even be a few without the hump. Here's he info you need- casting numbers.

It may not show up right because of the text box size but you can print it off this website.

www.mortec.com/castnum.htm

CASTING#.....SIZE...YEAR...MAIN CAP BOLTS....NOTES

140029.....350...80-84...2
330817.....400...72-80...2
355909.....262.....75....2
355909.....305...76-79...2
360851.....262...75-76...2...Monza V-8
361979.....305...77-79...2 or 4, some Canadian assembled heavy duty blocks have 4-bolt main caps
366245.....350...78-79...4...Bowtie
366286...................4...Bowtie, siamesed,
straight nodular iron main
caps, 2-piece seal, 4.00-4.150"
bores, 2.45" main journals
366298...................4...Bowtie, Aluminum, billet main caps, 3.398" bore with sleeves, two piece rear main seal.
366299...................4...Bowtie, Aluminum, nodular
iron splayed caps, wet sump,
4.00" bore
389257.....302.....67....2
393288.....283...65-67...2
460703.....350.....78....4
460776.....305...78-79...2
460777.....305...78-79...2
460778.....305...78-79...2 or 4, some Canadian assembled heavy duty truck blocks have 4-bolt main caps
471511.....267...79-82...2
3556519....283...58-61...2
3703524....265.....55....2...No oil filter
3720991....265...56-57...2
3731548....265...57......2...No side motor mounts
3731548....283...57......2...No side motor mounts
3737739....283...58-64...2
3756519....283...58-62...2
3782870....327...62-67...2
3789817....283...62-64...2
3789817....327...62-67...2
3789935....283...61-64...2
3790721....283...62-64...2...Chevy II recessed oil filter boss
3790721....327...65-66...2...Chevy II recessed oil filter boss
3791362....327...62-67...2...Chevy II recessed oil filter boss
3792563....327.....65....2
3792582....283...64-65...2
3794226....283...58-63...2
3794460....327...62-64...2
3830944....327.....63....2
3834810....283...64-66...2
3834812....283...62-63...2
3837739....283...58-62...2
3849852....283...57-66...2
3849935....283...65-67...2
3858174....327...64-67...2
3858180....327...64-67...2
3858618....350...68-76...2
3862194....283...65-67...2...Chevy II recessed oil filter boss
3862812....283...62-64...2
3892657....302.....67....2...Z-28 Camaro
3892657....327.....67....2
3892657....350.....67....2...Camaro
3896944....283...66-67...2
3896948....283...66-67...2
3903352....327.....67....2
3914636....307.....68....2
3914638....327.....68....2...Truck
3914653....307...68-73...2
3914660....327.....68....2
3914678....302.....68....2...Z-28 Camaro
3914678....327.....68....2
3914678....350.....68....2
3931174....307.....68....2...Truck
3932371....307...69-73...2
3932373....307...68-73...2
3932386....302.....69....4...Z-28 Camaro
3932386....327.....69....2
3932386....350.....69....4
3932388....327.....69....2
3932388....350.....69....2 or 4
3933180....327...68-69...2
3951509....400...70-71...4
3951509....400...74-80...2
3951511....400...70-73...4...Some replacement blocks had 2-bolt main caps
3956618....302.....69....4...Z-28 Camaro
3956618....327...68-69...2
3956618....350.....69....2 or 4
3956632....307.....69....2
3959512....327...62-67...2...Was also used for some "CE" replacement blocks
3959532....283...64......2...Used for some "CE" replacement blocks
3970010....302.....69....4...Z-28 Camaro
3970010....327.....69....2...Trucks and industrial
3970010....350...69-80...2 or 4
3970014....350...70-76...2 or 4
3970020....307...70-73...2
3970024....307...69-73...2
4715111....305.....80....2
6259425....350...69-76...2
10036033...350...........4...Goodwrench crate motor, 2-piece rear
seal, "Hecho en Mexico"
10046164...305.....86....2
10051182.................2 or 4...Bowtie, 3.75"-4.30" bores, 1 or 2-piece rear seal
10051184.................4...Bowtie, 4.00"-4.155" bores, 1 or 2-piece rear seal
10054727...350...86-up...2 or 4...one piece rear seal, some "Made in Canada"
10066036...350...........2 or 4...Target Master/Goodwrench crate motor, 2-piece rear
seal, "Hecho en Mexico"
10066038...350.....92....4...Goodwrench crate motor, 2-piece rear
seal, "Hecho en Mexico"
10090511...350.....90....2...LT-5, ZR1 Vette, 375hp
10125327...350...92-up...2 or 4...Gen.II LT-1, reverse flow cooling
10125327...350...96-up...2 or 4...Gen.II LT-4, reverse flow cooling
10134996.................4...Bowtie, Aluminum, 4.125" bore
2.65" main journals
10153558...350...91-92...4...LT-5, ZR1 Vette, 375hp
10168588...265...94-96...2...L99, Gen.II, 4.3 Liter V-8, Caprice, reverse flow cooling
10199001...350...93-95...4...LT-5, ZR1 Vette, 405hp
10243878...305...96-98...2...Vortec truck, roller cam, one-piece rear seal
10243880...350...95-00...2 or 4...Vortec truck, Gen.I crate motors and "ZZ4", roller cam, one piece rear seal
12550592...350...97-up...crossbolted block, Gen.III, "LS1", aluminum
12559378...350...99-up...crossbolted block, Gen.III, "LS1", aluminum
12559846...350...98-up...crossbolted block, Gen.III, "LS1", aluminum
12560621...350...98-up...crossbolted block, Gen.III, "LS1", aluminum
12560629...350...99......crossbolted block, Gen.III, "LS1", aluminum
12561168...350...01-up...crossbolted block, Gen.III, "LS1", aluminum
12561358...293...99-up...Gen.III, Used with 4.8L motors
12561358...325...99-up...Gen.III, used with 5.3L motors
12562174...350...98-up...crossbolted block, Gen.III, "LS1", aluminum
14010201...305...80-85...2
14010202...305...80-85...2
14010203...305...80-85...2
14010207...350...80-85...2 or 4
14010209...350...80-85...2 or 4
14010280...267...79-82...2
14011064...350...83......4
14011148...350...87-89.......Roller cam, one-piece rear seal
14016376...267...79-82...2
14016379...350...77-79...2 or 4
14016381...305...80-84...2
14016382...305...79-84...2
14016383...305...80-85...2...Truck
14079287...350...86-90.......Truck
14088526...350...87-89.......Roller cam, one-piece rear seal
14088548...350...86-88...2 or 4
14088551...305...86-87...2...one-piece rear main seal
14093627...305...87-91...2...Roller cam, one-piece rear seal
14093638...350...87-95...2 or 4...Roller or flat tappet cam
one-piece rear seal
14094766...305...86-up...2...One-piece rear seal
14101147...305...85-up...2
14101148...350...87-90...4...One-piece rear seal
14102058...305...87-91...2...Roller cam, one-piece rear seal
22551656.................4...Rocket block, 4.00"-4.190" bores, 2.45" main
journal sizes, splayed caps, dry sump,
2-piece rear seal, 9.025" deck




Car history decoding links:

www.phs-online.com/



A HUGE SMALL BLOCK!

www.renesbillet.com/

[Administrator]

massive cylinder head flow data@28" h2o
users.erols.com/srweiss/tablehdc.htm#chevy

users.erols.com/srweiss/tablehdc.htm#Pontiac

users.erols.com/srweiss/tablehdc.htm

www.wengines.com/flowdata.html

fuel pull over vid!
sputsengines.com/Dominator%20Carb%20View%201.wmv

sputsengines.com/Dominator%20Carb%20View%202.wmv

head flow surprises!
totalflowproducts.com/default.asp?page=6

Bore, Stroke, Rod (len.), Rod stroke, & Bore Stroke ratios chart
users.erols.com/srweiss/tablersn.htm


torque & horse power demystified!
vettenet.org/torquehp.html

muscle car horsepower & torque chart
userweb.suscom.net/~jasonrogers/musclecarstats.htm


How to lash valves:

The only way, the best way, the way every professional engine builder and race team does it...

Exhaust opening/Intake closing

When the exhaust just starts to open, adjust the lash on that cylinder's intake valve then turn over the engine until that intake valve has opened and almost closed then you adjust the lash on that cylinder's exhaust valve.

Check by using the go/no-go method...if you're setting .020 clearance then .019 goes and .021 does not go.




Rear Differentials 101

www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4JhruinbWc#t=1m50s

[Administrator]

MORE IMPORTANT RACER INFO! ;D
www.2quicknovas.com/happyguides.html
&
www.rhodescustomauto.com/
&
racingsecrets.com/
&
www.5speedtransmissions.com/startlineratio.html


STEPS TO TESTING & TUNING @ THE TRACK:

Nine Ninety
Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Chattanooga, TN


For track tuning to be helpful, the car has to be consistent. So the first order of business is to get the car to launch with little to no wheel spin. Obviously, launch technique and staging position needs to be the same each pass.

Once you get the car consistent, make 1 change at a time. When I go to the track for testing, I figure out in advance what the objective of my test is, what I am going to change and in what order. This helps me stay focused and keep from getting distracted when at the track. I try to test one parameter (or change) per test session with the objective of learning something specific that day.

Timing changes: Start low and work up in small increments (2 degress or less at a time)

Jetting changes: Start rich and work down until you trap MPH peaks.

Shock Adjustment: Rear shocks, start soft (but firm enough to avoid wheel hop) and work up until your 60' stops improving

Tire Pressure: Start testing rear tire pressure high and work down. With slicks, going too low can be a dangerous if not exciting ride. The right tire pressure depends on the weight of the car, the type of suspension/chassis, the width of the rims, etc. Go for the best 60' and watch the stability on the top end. Stop if it gets "spooky" on the top end.

Watch/monitor track and weather conditions. When these change they can mask/hide the effect of the tuning (good and bad). To minimize these effects, you are looking for a good weather day and try to make the passes as close together as possible.

When testing or racing, I have found that my first pass right off the trailer is usually .02-.04 slower than the next pass I make. So for testing, I make 2 runs to start with no changes to get a baseline and usually end up comparing any subsequent changes to my 2nd pass. I pick one lane and stay in that lane for all of the test passes.

STEPS TO TESTING & TUNING @ DYNO:

07-14-2005, 06:54 AM
455Turbo
Senior Chief Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: NH


For me, a chassis dyno is the absolute best way to maximize wheel horsepower. There are far fewer variables than with track testing. You don't have to worry about traction and shift points. I wouldn't call it playing with air/fuel and timing, it's much more scientific.

Your first dyno runs are to get the air/fuel mixture where you want it. Use the dyno's wide band 02 sensor. Set the timing conservatively, don't worry about how much power it makes. I run at 11.5 to 12 to 1 but my car is turbocharged so that might be a little rich for an aspirated car. It may take a few runs to get the air/fuel dialed in.

Once the air/fuel is where you want it it's time to advance the timing. I advance my total timing in 1 degree increments until the horsepower starts to fall off. Then I go back to the maximum power setting and call it a day.

On my last chassis dyno session I went from 650 rwhp to 730 rwhp in about an hour and a half.
__________________

[Administrator]

more insight to the automotive field!
hotrodders.com/kb/engine/calculators.html
users.erols.com/srweiss/index.html
www.tciauto.com/tech_info/calculators.htm#0
www.stealth316.com/2-calc-hp-et-mph.htm
www.wallaceracing.com/
www.5speedtransmissions.com/startlineratio.html
www.csgnetwork.com/automotiveconverters.html
live and learn.

[Administrator]

www.speedworldmotorplex.com/calc.htmhttp://www.tciauto.com/tech_info/calculators.htm#2

www.ondoperformance.com/calculators.html
MORE CALCULATORS & CONVERSION CHARTS FOR OUR READERS.


1/8mi. TO 1/4mi. CALCULATORS

www.empirenet.com/pkelley2/eight-to-quarter.htm

PRACTICE TREE

www.rbracing-rsr.com/nhraxtree.html


Rotational Mass, horsepower & acceleration!

www.w8ji.com/rotating_mass_acceleration.htm

[Administrator]

EXHAUST TECH LINKS:
www.torquetechexh.com/mufflers.htm
www.a-1performance.com/flow.htm
www.boyleworks.com/ta400/psp/exhaust.html

09-27-2000, 05:11 PM
David Holmberg
Kindergarten Cop Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Port Charlotte, Florida
Posts: 3,078



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I just received a letter from a friend who works for Robert Yates Racing. He stated in their tests the X type crossover always showed an improvement with any combination they tried. The reason they are not used in Short Track racing is because the added torque will break the tires loose coming out of the turns. That is a big problem for Nascar teams; getting the traction they need out of a corner and still have enough Horse Power for the straightaway. With too much low and mid range power they will over power the tires, much the same way a class racer will with limited tires and unlimited power. In general they have found a much wider torque curve and a slightly higher peak torque with an X type crossover, without any negative effects towards peak Horsepower. He also stated that he has been involved with top speed "Bonneville" Motorcycles that turn 13 thousand + RPM's and they have been using both a "Maxi" header and a header from "Murray", both are X type exhaust systems. I hope this information helps overcome some of the myths surrounding this type of exhaust system.

[Administrator]

SUSPENSION TUNING LINKS:


trzmotorsports.com/
buickperformance.com/Pinion.htm
chevyhiperformance.com/techarticles/46199
www.calvertracing.com
www.landrumspring.com/
216.178.81.108/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=13079 <~~(leaf spring tuning)
ALSO CONTACT RON RHODES AT THE LINK A FEW POSTS ABOVE.

DRAG RACE ALIGNMENTS FROM NATIONAL DRAGSTER:

The three truths of wheel alignment
Front-end alignment is important, and it carries with it a new set of truths. They're terms racers seldom discuss. In reality, all three deal with geometric angles. Here's the inside story.

Caster: Caster is the backward or forward tilt of the spindle as you look at it from the side of the wheel and tire combination. When caster is positive, this means the wheel assembly tilts backward, which in turn places weight behind the tire-contact patch. When caster is negative, the top of the spindle is tilted forward, which places weight in front of the tire-contact patch.

Caster is expressed in degrees and measures the amount the centerline of the spindle or, in the case of a solid axle, the kingpin, is tilted from true vertical. Typically, caster figures seldom go beyond -3/4 degrees, and in almost all high-performance applications, some amount of positive caster is required. Why? Simple. Think of positive caster as a means to self-center the steering. If you're familiar with bicycles, that's why touring bikes have a fork that's kicked out. It provides a big chunk of positive caster, which in turn gives the rider a lot of directional stability. In contrast, a mountain bike has a fork that's much closer to vertical. It provides lightning-quick turns but very little directional stability. You can easily ride the touring bike without your hands on the handlebars, but not the mountain bike.

Camber: Think of camber as the tilt of the wheel at the top, tilting in or tilting out. Camber is expressed and measured in degrees and looks at the tilt of the wheel from true vertical. Pretend that the wheel and tire combination tilts out at the top. This means the camber is positive. If the top of the wheel tilts in, the camber is negative. The real idea behind camber is to keep the tire planted squarely on the tarmac. This in turn creates maximum tire grip and overall front-end traction. In theory, it sounds as if zero degrees of camber is good. That isn't the case in the real world, though. Most cars require different camber figures while at rest so that good grip and tire wear are maintained as the car travels down the road. Typically, a car with a small amount of negative camber will exhibit better dragstrip handling characteristics without killing the tire.

Toe: Toe, whether in or out, is the difference in distance measured across the face of the front tire and that of the trailing end of the same tire viewed from head on. Toe-in creates a pigeon-toed look with the front of the tires pointing inward. Toe-out is just the opposite with the front of the tires pointing out. The actual toe setting is seldom zero. In most street car applications, a small amount of toe-in, usually 1/16- or 1/32-inch, is common. Why? Because as the car moves down the road, the dynamics present on all of the steering and suspension components tend to force everything outward. This results in almost zero toe as the car is in motion.

Dialing in caster, camber, and toe
In the chart that follows, we've compiled GM's wheel-alignment specifications for late-model F platforms. If you decide to drag race such a car, try adding a bit more caster, up to six degrees if you can. Keep an eye on the toe change while the car is jacked through its travel. Toe-in change must be kept to a minimum. The last thing you need is toe-out; this usually isn't a problem with the front suspension on the new Firebirds and Camaros, but it can plague some earlier cars.

Before you do a wheel alignment on any drag car, place weight in the driver's seat that is equal to the driver's weight. Shot bags or weight-lifting equipment will work. Be sure to top the fuel tank with the appropriate level of gasoline. Set the tire pressures to the level you normally race with (i.e., high pressure on the nose and lower at the rear). With the car on the alignment rack, jack the nose up to duplicate a normal race attitude — an inch or two seems to be about right. The car is ready for the alignment. Remember that every car will be slightly different; the chart above shows the OEM alignment figures:

Because every car in competition will be different, use the following basic guidelines for wheel alignment.


Camber should be set at zero; try to keep the front wheels straight up and down
Toe-in should be zero; toe-in change should be kept to an absolute minimum; be positive that the car does not exhibit any toe-out while the nose is in the air
Caster should be between three degrees and six degrees
Bump steer must be eliminated at all costs
Aside from shock absorbers and springs, the above is the long and short of Stock eliminator front-suspension systems. In a future issue, I'll discuss front shock absorbers for Stock eliminator combinations. You might be surprised by the sophistication of shocks in use today. Watch for it.

CALTRAC TUNING TIPS:

01-19-2004, 09:27 PM
torqjunki
Chief Ponti-yacker Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Spring, TX
Posts: 653


Made first trip to the track Sunday since installing the cal-tracs, split mono's and QA1 12-ways. Made one pass before track was rained out. It was about 45 degrees out with a light mist of moisture in the air. Worst possible scenario for traction. Heard several high powered cars pedaling down the track while unloading. I was sure I'd be doing the same. Set the tires at 13psi cold, warmed all the fluids and hit the track. The car left hard with no spin and carried the tires out and went straight. THis was on motor BTW. 60FT was 1.52. Previous was 1.57 on better track with 11 psi hot. Really suprised it hooked at all. With my weight in the drivers seat, I adjusted the stop on the cal-tracs to touch the spring. I had the QA1's on #2 setting for this run. My question is, should I change the setting on the shocks for the nitrous run? Will hit with 175 initially, and if successfull, will try more.

MORE


torqjunki
Chief Ponti-yacker Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Spring, TX
Posts: 658



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

GOt another oportunity to test Sat. The track was somewhat questionable early and got better late. As a starting point, pinion angle was -3, rear shocks on 6, no gap or pre-load on bars, 10psi cold in tires. Front shocks on lightest setting. Leaving off idle netted 1.55 best. Played with rear shocks, going to 8 and also trying 4. 60fts stayed 1.56 to 1.58 favoring the stiffer settings slightly. I then tried leaving up on the converter pretty hard. It went 1.53. I put in 2 flats of preload and tried again on and off the converter staying at 1.53. I tightend the front shocks to stiff setting. THe 60 ft did not improve, but felt like like it hooked a little better. The car is not hazing or spinning, seems to slip and grab, slip and grab. Like a tire shake feel or driving over a wash-board. I made 9 passes on motor alone. OUt of ideas, it was time to spray 200 shot. I set bottle press low at 800 psi. Tire pressure was too low and car was moving around so I got out of it. 60ft was 1.50. Set tire pressure at 13 warm. Set bottle pressure at 900 since the 800psi felt like a motor pass. The car spun just about all the way through first and went straight through the quarter. 60ft was 1.51. This was a great improvement from last outing in which the car did not go 4 feet before blowing the tires off. When the smoke settled, it was a best of 10.62 on the motor and 9.78 at 139.5 on the gas. The fact that the car leaves better on the converter confuses me, but may be a hint to the cure to make this thing hook. Anyone with Cal=-trac experience got any ideas???



01-27-2004, 10:59 AM
Hot Rod
Chief Ponti-yacker Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: At my Remote location in Wadsworth, Ohio
Posts: 810


Everybody is correct...

Biggest problem is that -6 degrees pinion angle.... That in its self should be corrected first... {I have mine a -4 with the Split-Mono's}

Your hitting the rear tires way to hard and the rear shocks cannot keep them down on the track... because the rear is hitting so hard, the front is reacting but it cannot keep it in a upward motion.... As the rear springs react and wrap up much quicker than they are suppose to, this will cause the front end to start coming down, when the rear springs un-wrap as this happens it force's the rear tires to unload.....
Kind of like a reverse "Flipper" motion...
I recommend doing nothing else but changing the pinion angle and then adjust from there, at the track.....

If you make multable changes you will have a tough time tuning the suspension.... and as a side note get a pad and pencil and each time you make an adjustment write it down for future reference, it will make a world of difference...

Also you noted that you changed the bar location on the front from the upper hole to the lower.... Draw a line visually on the angle that the bar is going.... If it's way out in front of the vehicle you are trying to lift your vehicle and some of the track in front of you...
What you are looking for is the line to intersect with the spindle of the front wheel and that is in a ideal situation mine is close but not exactly......


One question.... How did you adjust you Cal-Trac bars... Please be specific on the steps and where you in the car when they were set.....

John will give you a base line to start from, and you will find that you will come up with a different adjustment...

Also remember that his car is a stick not a Auto...

Hope this will help.....
Rodney

AND HERE'S MORE

07-01-2005, 07:29 PM
Hot Rod
Chief Ponti-yacker Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: At my Remote location in Wadsworth, Ohio

This is the way I set up my 75TA!

I set the pinion angle on my car at -4.5 degrees!
I have the car on a Drive on Rack (Hunter Wheel Alignment Rack). While I am setting the the TA I have Gary another instructor at the College adjust the Drivers side first the thickness of about a quarter and then the passenger side set at the thickness of a dime! What Brian and I are saying is we are taking the measurements where the bolt that rides on the spring where the pre-load is applied!
Also I always use the top hole for the Cal-Trac Bar. If you have any other questions feel free and give me a shout at 703-405-4780..

Rodney


-2005, 05:00 PM
Brian Baker
Ultimate Warrior Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Glen Burnie, MD USA

No "cheat sheet"? That bites.

Start out with the upper hole in the fulcrum piece that mounts on the front spring eye.

Take your leaf springs out completely to install the solid bushings...trust me, it's the most painless way to do it.

For street driving it's recommended that they be adjusted "loose". Leave just enough gap between the stop bolt and the top of the leaf spring to slide a dime in between them.

At the track, with you in the car and the rear axle on jack stands, have a friend adjust them so they just touch the top of the spring, but don't add any preload. Use this as your baseline and go from there.


2005, 06:09 PM
sixt8bird
Chief Ponti-yacker Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Snohomish Washington

It depends on how stiff your rear springs are. I actually have 1979 WS6 TA springs in my 1968 Firebird and the back suspension feels like a brick. I preload 1/2 turn and it seems to work great at the track and on the street. I like a solid feeling car.

-2005, 06:36 PM
gjn
"68 Firebird 461 Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Overland Park, KS


My 68 has stock replacement multileaf springs and they too feel like a brick and like 1/2 turn on the drivers side and 3/4 turn on the passenger side of preload. I do not notice the preload on the street.

GJN

01-2005, 11:44 PM
SLOW 77
Senior Chief Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: DFW, TX

Mine is almost identical to Hotrod's. I have -4 degrees down angle; to get this though I had to weld to Moroso 4 degree shims together. Yes, that would be 8 degrees total. For what ever reason that gives my car 4 negative with the pads and all other variations.
I have 0 preload on the drivers side, and 1/2 turn on the pass side. I have the exact same setup on my anti-sway bar too. I had a friend set it up, and he is relatives of somebody that works at Wolfe Racecraft. Mine has hooked geat ever since, even on the street.




NEW LEAFSPRING TRICKS:
By:
Pontiac e

Looks like the new Hot set up for leaf spring cars to compete with the Mustangs in certain organizations where rules allow coilovers.

Hummmmmmmmmmmmmm. big motor nova has gone 5.0's in the eight with this set up.


Quote:
Calvert Split Mono leafs and Cal Trac Bars. They only use the front half of the split mono leaf spring with the Cal Trac's and have Coil-overs to suspend the car on it. Basically turns the front half of the leaf spring with the Cal trac into a ladder bar and ORSCA says it is legal..? If you look in the picture that John posted you can see the Coil-overs and the Cal trac's. It works pretty well evidently.
There is a Nova in this class set up the same way. They let the Leaf spring cars do this because some of the Mustangs and Late Model Camaro's are 60' in the low 1.20's in EZ.

__________________
Build it fast, build it right, build a "e" powered Pontiac.


superchevy.com/technical/chassis/suspension_steering/0507sc_fat/

www.fatmanfab.com/06page23.htm

[Administrator]

FUEL FOR THOUGHT!!!

07-04-2003, 01:46 PM
Tom Vaught
Ultimate Warrior Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: The United States of America
Posts: 5,181


Quote:

"I don't understand. I can see where more pressure would force in more fuel to a point , then after that, needle and seat would work as restrictor, wouldn't it? I use the Ebrock .149" seat, with #6 line, Holley blue support to PY mech pump, on my race Qjet. Just 347 hp though."

When I was a SCCA Tech Inspector, all of the Trans Am teams were able to run with Holley BLUE
pumps and the normal Holley regulator and had
no fuel starvation problems. The second pump was a back-up and was not normally used. On the straight-away they could run over 140 mph on certain tracks. The cars were always on and off the gas or were running somewhat below their max speed to conserve fuel. This gave the bowls time to catch up.

Drag Racing is another whole game. Drag racers
figured out early on that acceleration forces
were killing them which is why they mounted fuel tanks in the front of the vehicles.

You install a fuel line the same size as the needle and seat and the wall friction and bends
in the line will kill the flow even though the
needle and seat can only pass .110 area of fuel.

For years it was proven that a 3/8 line could feed a mid to low 10 second vehicle with a good pump. If a little bit is good a whole lot must be better so people went to larger 1/2 inch line and
now under acceleration the blue pump could not match the acceleration forces due to the larger volume of fuel it had to push.

Next step was dual blue pumps with two 1/2 inch
lines but the problem was not solved as the blue
pump(s) pressure relief spring was the issue.

Grumpy Jenkins (an engineer from Cornell U) was
one of the first to use a high pressure spring in
two blue pumps with a single 1/2 line and two
blue pump regulators. The orifice in a blue regulator is only slightly bigger that a needle
and seat so one regulator is not enough on a high
hp drag engine.

From then on it was bigger lines, bigger pumps,
and bigger regulators or more of them.

Jim Brady was running a quick 10 second car (1964
steel GTO) and when I sent him a Mallory 140 pump
and Holley 7/16 ball regulator, he picked up
THREE tenths in the quarter.

The problem in some cases can be something as simple as the wiring not being big enough for
the load of the pump(s).

Our 600 hp Mustang with the Vortech supercharger
never made over 500 hp with the factory pump or
with a Bosch EFI race pump. The engineers fought
the lean problem for a month. They asked me to
help, I looked at the wiring, had them run 10 gage
wires to the pump and ground and the engine made
600 hp.

Need to look at the whole system and the required application. Not just the size of the needle and seat. I will say though that you can exceed the
fuel requirements of the needles and seats on a
Good Dominator set-up and if you do going to DUAL
needle and seat bowls will fix the problem vs
going to a dual carb (4 needles and seats) set-up.

Tom V.


I refuse to have a Battle of Wits as an unarmed combatant

(even more!)


Today, 10:34 AM
White Warrior
Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Downers Grove,Il
Posts: 237

First of all it takes a much bigger pump to feed an engine at the drag strip than on a dyno. You have to overcome the inertia effect of pumping forward a fluid that wants to go backward because you are accelerating. This is also a reason why too large a fuel line can be detrimental.
I went thru 2 fuel system upgrades,from 1 Holley Blue which was only good for high tens to 2 Holley Blues which got me down into the middle 9's and then to the Holley 250,which got me into the high 8's


Yesterday, 12:01 AM
racegto65
Member Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Las Vegas,Nevada
Posts: 44


I have run a non-HP 9375 for the last 15 years...same carburetor. The car runs 9.60-9.70 at the same altitude and weighs 2920 lbs. I had the same problems you are having and vowed that it wasn't a fuel delivery problem...wrong.

I ran the test that Barry Grant had published in Natl Dragster. After seeing the results of the test, I replaced the entire fuel system (ie: pump, lines, and regulator). The car immediately began running rich for the first time ever with the same jets before the fuel system replacement. At that point, the car became tunable and I was able to see results for the first time when making jet changes.

This is what I changed:

From: 2 Holley Blue pumps with Moroso high pressure springs and 1 #10 fuel line to 2 Holley Dead Head regulators, and 4 #8 lines to the carburetor.

To: 1 Mallory 250 pump, 1 #10 feed and 1 #10 return line, 1 Mallory 4-port return style regulator, and 2 #8 lines to the carburetor.

11-07-2004, 10:59 AM
torqjunki
Chief Ponti-yacker Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Spring, TX
Posts: 653


I have spent countless hours tuning my street\strip(mostly strip) car with 8896 Dominator to achieve decent drivability without hurting WOT. I have tried several times to run without power valves with the Victor intake. It was almost undrivable. Performance was equal, but driveability suffered badly. I run a 3.5 pv in the front with 87 jet. In the rear, I use Holley jet extensions that have been drilled out(some have small ID) I run 98 jets in the rear with no pv. I also run the front float level a little low. THis will delay the fuel to the booster a little and improve part throttle smoothness. In addition to this, I use .040 idle air bleeds, .060 intermediate bleed and .0465 high speed bleed. Please note that the intermediate and high speed bleeds are far from stock specs. In back to back testing 2 weeks ago, I went back to stock bleeds and made several passes jetting to max MPH and et. Went back to my old set-up and immediatly picked up a tenth and mph. Car was very nice to drive also. I think the larger air bleeds introduce more air into the fuel with helps atomize it better leaving the carb. Please note that I am at sea level, your jetting may be different. My combo is similar but 462ci. As a side note, my car is 1 tenth quicker with modified torker 2. Larry Navarro can post a pic if he reads this

[Administrator]

MORE FUEL FOR THOUGHT!
from www.barrygrant.com


Technical Info
Previous Page Next Page

Chapter

Air Delivery Fuel Delivery The Fuel Can Test Fuel Filters
Controlling Fuel Pressure Settings Regulators and Bypasses

Basic Carburetor and Fuel System Maintenance and Tuning Tips
There is no substitute for a well-designed fuel and air delivery system. By ignoring these two critical areas, all the work of building a strong powerplant is wasted.

Air Delivery
For maximum horsepower, the coolest, most dense air possible should be available at the carburetor inlet. Keeping restriction in the inlet path to a minimum - or better yet, pressurizing the air - is also desirable.
The denser the air, the more you can get into the cylinders. This allows the engine to burn more fuel and make more power. We recommend that a hood scoop or outside air intake should be installed wherever rules allow. Under hood air is heated by the engine and headers and reduces the amount of power that can be produced. A reduction in temperature of 10 degrees F. is approximately equal to a one percent power gain.
There should be a minimum of three inches of clearance between the top of the venturis and a hood scoop. If an air cleaner is installed, the tallest possible element is preferred with four-inch element preferred for racing engines over 500 HP.
When a hood scoop or external air intake is used, it is highly suggested that the carburetor be sealed to it. Otherwise, air will flow across the top of the carb and out of the inlet tract rather than into the air horn. If air is forced past the carburetor it can siphon fuel, causing the engine to run lean. Windshield snorkels are especially notorious for siphoning unless the rear is sealed. Air pan kits for sealing the carburetor to the scoop are available or they can be fabricated. An air bell or radiused intake should be used whenever possible to increase air flow into the carburetor.
It is not unusual for a drag race car to improve ETs by 0.3 second and increase top speed by as much as seven miles an hou after installation of a sealed scoop. A car will not pick up ET after the scoop is sealed off if the scoop is too short or the fuel delivery system is inadequate.
On oval track cars, the same is true. Paying attention to the inle tract design will pay off. Depending upon track length, oval track cars will typically improve lap times by 0.1 to 0.5 second once an optimized air intake system is installed.

Fuel Delivery
Many racers experience fuel delivery problems without ever being aware that something is wrong in their race car’s fuel systems. Today’s state-of-the-art engines produce a lot more power than a race engine of ten years ago. The process of producing horsepower revolves around the conversion of fuel into energy. The more pounds of fuel an engine can burn efficiently per hour, the more horsepower it produces. Even though your car may not miss, pop, bang, skip or do anything else peculiar, it may not be getting all the fuel it needs to make maximum power.
In oval track applications, a BG Belt Drive or Hex Drive Fuel Pump is preferred where use of a mechanical fuel pump is specified. These pumps offer the highest fuel delivery volume of any mechanical pump yet maintains low fuel pressure at low engine speeds. This feature alleviates “loading up” of the spark plugs. The BG Six-valve and Super Speedway mechanical fuel pumps will also deliver ample fuel volume when used according to recommendations.
For drag race cars, a BG400-2 Electric Fuel Pump is the best way to guard against fuel starvation. If a car is “lazy” or “lays down” at mid-track then pulls well in a higher gear, the engine may be experiencing intermittent fuel starvation.
Why? Typically, the carburetor bowls are full at the starting line so the car leaves hard but in the process, drains the bowls dry. In the lower gears, the car accelerates rapidly with the engine picking up rpm very quickly. This rapid acceleration increases the demand for fuel. When the float bowl fuel level drops, the car “lays down” because of fuel starvation. In high gear, engine speed increases more slowly allowing the bowls to fill again.

The Fuel Can Test
There's been no shortage of well-researched and well-written articles and books explaining the workings of the fuel system. However, many racers, both novice and experienced alike do not fully understand the physics of fuel flow and horsepower. To produce torque and horsepower requires a mixture of air and fuel. To produce 1-horsepower for 1-hour requires approximately .5-lbs of gasoline. If you ran a single-cylinder engine, like the one in your lawnmower, under a load of 1-horsepower for 1-hour and weighed the fuel tank before and after, the tank would weigh approximately .5-lb (five-tenths of a pound) lighter. Therefore the equation for fuel flow is 1-H.P. = .5-lb of fuel, per hour.
This is expressed on a dyno sheet as B.S.F.C. (Brake Specific Fuel Consumption). Highly-tuned racing engines can sometimes by more efficient, yielding B.S.F.C. figures of around #.40 which means 4-tenths of a lb of fuel, per h.p., per hour. Incidentally, the formula for Alcohol is approximately 1-lb of fuel, per h.p. per hour which, as a consequence, necessitates the running of a belt-drive pump, but that's another story.

Typically, a 600-HP engine will require 300-lbs of gasoline per hour and, by the same formula, an 800-HP engine needs 400-lbs per hour. Remember, these quantities of fuel have to be delivered past the needles and seats and the fuel pressure regulator. Consider also, the fuel delivery system has to combat 'G' Forces: loadings that are so formidable they can threaten to stall the fuel in the line (this may also give a clue as to why a fuel line that is too large in diameter can be as harmful as one that is too small). This leads us to the area that is least understood.
When you have only one carburetor it should be easier to feed than two, right? Wrong, in an engine with a tunnel-ram layout, both the needle and seat area and the float bowl capacity have doubled! Whereas the single four-barrel car that is most prevalent today, has a much harder task in keeping the fuel bowls full! A 700-HP tunnel-ram engine needs 350-lbs of fuel per hour which equates to a little over 85-lbs per float bowl. A 700-HP engine running a single four-barrel (not so uncommon these days) needs 175-lbs per float bowl, compared to a 1200-HP Pro Stock engine with demands of 600-lbs max, 150-lbs per bowl.
So what happens if fuel delivery is weak? Your engine may not miss or "burn-up" parts. It may just not perform to expectations. The new camshaft, racing-carburetor, or flowed-heads that didn't pick-you-up may have overstressed an already taxed fuel delivery system. Carburetors cannot disperse the optimum air/fuel mixture unless the fuel system has the ability to maintain correct float bowl levels. Fuel levels that are two low may not cause the motor to miss or "burn" a piston, but they will reduce fuel flow and performance will suffer. It is not uncommon after upgrading a fuel system with a single four-barrel carburetor to pick up 1- to 4-tenths of a second. In extreme cases, E.T.s have been known to decrease by as much as 1 second!
Can a fuel system that is too large hurt performance? No, it assures your combination will reach its full potential: the needles and seats will shut when the float bowls are full. Conversely, if your fuel system is marginal, fluctuations in battery voltage will cause fuel flow changes from run-to-run which affects the float levels in the carburetors and out-the-window goes your consistency! So how do you know if your volume is adequate?
Test your fuel system by obtaining a 1-gallon gas-can (do not use a moulded-plactic gas container, or marked super-jug, or antifreeze-jug as you will not get accurate readings). Open up the top of the tin-can and insert the two or four carburetor fuel lines from your regulator, switch on the system and carefully measure the time it takes to fill it. High 10-second cars will need to pump 1-gallon in 25-seconds or less. A 9-second car should fill the can in 20-seconds or less, 15-seconds is all it takes for an 8-second car and under 12-seconds for 7-second vehicles. Important Note: It's essential to observe two strict rules during the test. One, keep a fire extinguisher handy and two, do not carry-out the test by yourself.
1/4 Mile E.T. Time to fill a
1-Gallon Gas Can
7 sec under 12 seconds
8 sec 15 seconds
9 sec 20 seconds
10 sec 25 seconds
11 sec 30 seconds
12 sec 35 seconds


How do you know you're getting all of the performance from your car? Perform the gas-can test even if your car is running well - you have nothing to lose and everything to gain: including the prospects of improving your E.T. and gaining increased consistency.
When your car isn't performing, always carry out the gas-can test first - it's one of the least-expensive diagnostic aids you'll encounter. Keep in mind that valve springs, ignitions systems, torque converters, even engines have been changed, when all the time the fuel system was at fault.
So, my car has failed the test - now what do I do? Call us at BG Fuel Systems: we have the correct fuel pumps, regulators and plumbing for your particular H.P. level. Rely on The BG Powerfuel Advantage to help put you in the winners circle.

Fuel Filters
For the same reason, only filters specifically designed for racing, such as the BG5000 or BG Inline filter, should be installed. Use of a filter is strongly advised as long as it doesn’t restrict fuel flow. The fuel filter should be installed in the line before the fuel pump. This filters the fuel, preventing any damaging material from entering the fuel pump or the rest of the system

Controlling Fuel Pressure Settings
Fuel pressure should be set between 6 and 8 psi for a gasoline carburetor. An alcohol carburetor is a different animal with very different requirements. The Alky carburetor will require 4 to 5 psi at idle and 9 to 12 psi at wide open throttle.
Remember, fuel pressure is not a substitute for volume! If the fuel bowls are not full, the pressure is meaningless. In fact, fuel pressure is simply an indication of the amount of restriction in the fuel system.

Regulators and Bypasses
Most electrical fuel pump systems require the use of a fuel pressure regulator. One BG regulator is sufficient in many applications. The use of two regulators is recommended when using other types of regulators or in high horsepower engines to avoid excessive fuel restriction and provide adequate volume.
With mechanical fuel pumps, and some electrical pumps, a bypass is preferred rather than a regulator. A diaphragm bypass without an idle bleed is recommended when constant fuel pressure is needed from an electrical or mechanical pump. A belt driven fuel pump, using gasoline or alcohol, requires a diaphragm bypass with an idle bleed. Higher pressure mechanical fuel pumps delivering alcohol, such as the 15-psi BG Six-valve, require a throttle bypass to supply the variable fuel pressure required by the carburetor.

Some quick & dirty examples:

Holley red = 97 GPH free flow,67 GPH @ 5 psi.

Holley blue = 110 GPH free flow,70 GPH @ 7 psi.

Holley black = 140 GPH free flow,120 GPH @ 9 psi.

Mallory Comp 110 = 110 GPH free flow,appx. 75 GPH @ 6 psi.

Mallory Comp 140 = 140 GPH free flow,appx. 120 GPH @ 9 psi.

Mallory Comp 250 = 250 GPH free flow,appx. 200 GPH @ 15 psi.

Most pumps have a loose relationship between psi and gph,generally speaking more psi capabillity = more gph capabillity,and vice versa,but it's a tenuous relationship in some respects.

It is possible to change that scenario to some degree,you know,say up the pressure without gaining significant gph potential (high psi/same gph),EFI fuel pumps typically are built like this.

But rare is the situation where you'll find a low pressure/high volume pump (lower psi/higher gph),as that's a much harder thing to make happen.

So understand that pressure is typically looked @ as the measure of resistance the system operates under,and that resistance often affects actual flow volume (gph).

Though volume is a much harder deal to quantify than pressure,as it's measure is harder to "see" in typical fuel systems.

But here's the thing,typically,the harder the car pulls on the track,the more psi that is needed to overcome the forces trying to push the fuel in the system back into the tank/cell,so typically the more pump "overhead" that is needed to deal with that situation.

And that pump "overhead" is typically seen by us end consumers as a higher gph/psi rating.

[glow=red,2,300]SUPER STOCK TECH![/glow]

Yesterday, 02:50 PM
NHRASuperStock455SD
Senior Chief Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Indy
Posts: 435



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jim,

Looks like you made some good power. A typical average race engine makes power as below:

HP = .255 x 8 x CFM = .255x8x341cfm = 695HP (Pretty close.)

The equation we use for Super Stockers is:

HP = .285 x 8 x CFM = .285 x 8 x 341 = 777HP

Although I assure you there aren't any SS Pontiacs flowing 341 cfm, all mostly less than 300 cfm. Super Stockers get this additional HP by maximizing cylinder seal, reducing reciprocating weight and optimizing intake and exhaust tuning to gain the additional %VE necessary to overcome cylinder head/compression issues. Our net 9.2 CR we hope to surpass the 700HP mark with all OEM castings this year. The 0.285 factor is limited as Super Stockers are limited to close to stock compression ratios, OEM cylinder heads with small intake ports, heavy steel rods, stock carbs that limit these engines to make higher horsepower values.

Competition Eliminator engine average this: (some are now at 0.320)

HP = .310 x 8 x cfm = .310 x 8 x 341 = 845HP

To make this power with this head flow, everything else must be optimal. You are probably a little short on compression. Exhaust would have to come in near perfect minimizing any reversion. Intake and Exhaust tuning would require a very good %VE.

Cylinder head minimum CSA would be approximately 3.09 square inches during the entire length of the intake port.

CSA = borexborexstrokexRPMx.00353/614fps

A custom valve train with a 1.8 rocker ratio with over .900 lift, and currently 1 inch lift is required these days. Preferably with a 60mm cam design. A sheet metal intake with two carbs.

So, you see it is all very expensive to squeeze HP out of heads, rather than the other way around.


My first question is just like Bobzcar, why did you stop at 6500 when that was your peak power?

I did see a significant drop in the BSFC after 6000 as with the typical Pontiac engine. This usually is 9 times out of 10 valve train losses causing valve bounce. A smooth reduction in BSFC is normal, but when it drops off suddenly, then other negative forces are usually to blame.

2 inch headers are definitely limiting power. You need at least a 2 1/8 to 2 1/4. However if you don't have the valve train to make power higher, then forget it. Also if you want to run the car at the peak torque, then it isn't as necessary.

If it were me, I would be trying to gain power 6500 to 7500, but if you are wanting the motor to come in 5500 to 6500, then you are doing good, and you have a good motor. It really depends on you.

That engine from a birds eye view is worth another 50 to 75HP, but it would involve gaining at least 300 to 500 more RPM to the peak power. Valve train is an expensive upgrade. If it is a bracket car, it probably isn't worth the extra trouble and expense to the average guy.

Pontiacs make very good power down low, which makes a reliable affordable engine make tons of power relatively inexpensively as compared to some of these $35-$50k comp eliminator engines. Super Stock engines typically cost $25k to $30k. That is for a cheesy small block

Lynn